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How to grow your business with a sales funnel that goes against all the rules with Jennifer Spivak

In this week’s podcast episode I’m speaking to the lovely Jennifer Spivak who is the CEO and founder of an all-female Facebook and Instagram Advertising agency, working with women entrepreneurs to make more money and smash the patriarchy! We talk all about why Jennifer does what she does, ad funnels, building connections with your audience and setting boundaries in your business.

KEY TAKEAWAYS COVERED IN THE PODCAST
  • Don’t get too creative with your ads, keep it simple.
  • Send cold audiences to a sales page with all the information they will need.
  • Price qualify to eliminate people who are not your target audience.
  • Tell people who you are and what you do, don’t make it too salesy.
  • It’s okay to put people off your service if they are not the right match for you.
  • Don’t be afraid to have boundaries with your lead generation.
  • Decide what your non-negotiables are – You are the business owner, it is your business.
  • Show your potential customers your credibility, your personality and also your vulnerability.
  • Talk about your story and the lessons you have learnt along the way – relatable to others.
  • We need to build connections.
  • Remarketing to a small audience isn’t too expensive.
  • You don’t have to add value every time you post, you can also talk about you and what you do.
THE ONE THING YOU NEED TO REMEMBER ABOVE ALL ELSE…

Ads don’t always have to be salesy, give your audience an insight into who they are buying from and show off your personality, because no one else is you!

HIGHLIGHTS YOU SIMPLY CAN’T MISS
  • An Introduction to Jennifer – 10:27
  • Support for domestic violence – 16:20
  • Ad funnels explained – 25:00
  • Setting boundaries in your business – 32:45
  • Email marketing to a cold audience – 44:15
  • Remarketing – 58:50
  • Example ad content – 01:04:40
LINKS TO RESOURCES MENTIONED IN TODAY’S EPISODE

Join my mailing list

Check Jennifer out!

Transcript Below

 

Teresa: Hello and welcome to this week's episode of the podcast. How are you doing this week? So I'm jumping straight in. I've got a great guest for you today. You know, one of the things I love about doing the podcast is that I get to learn from people and I particularly like it when it's a subject or it's a conversation, where I don't know, or it's different to how I think, or I learned something new because it's just really nice to have that opportunity to be the stupid person in the room, asking the questions and really kind of getting something new. So I love it. Now when I saw, or when I was approached, I should say for today's podcast guest, I,

 

I looked at what she was saying, and I looked at what she wanted to talk about, and it kind of, uh, I don't want to go as far as they triggered me cause it wasn't that bad, but it did make me go, “Oh, okay”. Because her leading title was “Why you don't need lead magnets.” Right. And if you listened to this podcast regularly you know, I am a big fan of a lead magnet. So I was like, you know, almost just a little bit defensive a little bit, like, “Come on then what, what you say in what's this about then?” And I decided that I needed to interview her. I needed to have a conversation with her and find out what her strategy was and why she did it.

 

And also like. As the interview went on, other things kept coming up when it was almost like take everything I've ever told you and turn it on its head. Like seriously. It was kind of crazy. Brilliant, amazing, funny, like all at once. So. Obviously we have particular strategies for doing things, and I have the kind of lead magnet way and loving them with emails and talking about the customer, not about yourself.

 

And that's the way, obviously I tend to work, but I love it when someone shows me something different or does something different and what I love even more is that she's got results to prove it. So what I think you're going to get from this episode is that. It's not a one size fits all it never, ever is.

 

In fact, if you're on my email list, you know, I had a little rant about this, not so long ago in the fact of. It really bothers me when someone is an expert because they got good at that one thing, like, say for instance, it's like someone who just does Instagram and teaches Instagram, cause their own account was really successful and it's like, that's cool.

 

That's brilliant. And if you wanted to be just like them in their industry with their customers, they are the perfect person to teach you that. However, if you're in a different industry, different customers, different business, then. Who says that's going to work. So the one size fits all is really kind of.

 

It does frustrate me in the sense of, I have got like a whole host of tools and tactics and strategies, but I have used for years on different things. And some things are work really well and others not so much. And what we talk about in this episode is her strategies and her tactics are very much geared to people who run marketing agencies, freelance consultants, those sorts of people who are trying to get clients to work with. So the done for you service. So if you have a done for you, I, you do someone's Facebook ads, or you do someone's social media. Then this episode is gold. It's so good. And there's so much good stuff in there, but also if you're not from that industry, then just still listen, just still listen to the facts of like, This is a different approach, a different way of doing things.

 

And I love how we get on. We, I had a scream and I've said I've never met her before. She was great fan. And, and it was a really, really good episode to record. We both really enjoyed it because it was almost like this really friendly, sparring. She would say something I'm like, hang on a minute here.

 

You know, you can't go tell them, them that type of thing. Um, because it was different. Maybe what I say, but, but different horses for different courses. You know what I mean? So your business might work brilliantly doing what she said, or it might work brilliantly doing what I say. But for me, this is a perfect timing in terms of, like I said, I, you know, I see lots of other groups.

 

I see lots of other people. I see lots of other conversations. I follow lots of people and I see people trying to like give the same advice and telling everybody, just put your prices up or just do this, or just do that. And it's like, it doesn't always work like that. Like one of the reasons I love doing the 90 day program so much is that I get into to your business.

 

I get to understand who you are and then I can give you proper advice. Based on years and years of marketing experience. Not here's the cookie cutter approach. This worked for me. And therefore this is going to work for you. There's so many different things. What stage of the business are you at? What you know, experienced, do you have who've you worked with, what do you love doing?

 

I remember talking to someone who was on the 90 day program once who would. Who'd taken some well, had been given some advice from another expert who had said, don't waste your time doing meetings. Don't waste your time having clients do a one to many thing. And I said to her, what do you like to do? And she's like, I love going to meet clients.

 

I love chatting with them. I love dealing with client. And I'm like, well, obviously that one too many things is not for you then. So carry on doing what you're doing. Obviously make it profitable. Obviously make sure that you have a constant sort of feed of people coming into that funnel. But if that's what you like, that's what you should do.

 

But this other expert who, who didn't know her as much, or didn't know that that's what she actually like was like no wasting money, wasted time wasted, you know, really kind of, you know, almost. Sort of belittled the thing that she liked the wanted to do. And it's like, just because that fits for me or someone else does not mean that it's going to fit for you.

 

So like I said, you know, I didn't mean to go into a little bit of a rant here, but it was just so perfect that I recorded this episode. That was a really kind of. Not against what I teach at all. It was just another viewpoint and it was a really interesting viewpoint. And when I sent my kind of slightly ranty email out to everyone the other week in my list, I decided to list all the industries that I'd worked with.

 

So I'd, I'd kind of talked about the fact. Well, one, I said, I don't normally sit, well, sorry. I normally sit on the fence about stuff like this, because I don't like to rock the boat, but I was just so passionate about this, that I was sort of saying, you know, that. Like I said, you know, if they've only had proven results in their own business and their own industry, it's really hard for them to say, I know how to market your business.

 

So I listed who I've worked with. And these are companies that I have physically done their marketing for. These aren't people who I've just stood in a room and talk, or they've been a member of the Academy. These are actual businesses over my 16 years where I have gone and understood their business and explained to them what they need to do.

 

And in most cases I've done it for them. So I have marketed cars, chicken medical supplies, clothing, banking, personal trainers, consultants, musicians, coaches, beauty products, childcare services, telescopic slides. Yeah. Who knew they need marketing vehicle conversions, food festivals, military museums, fire doors that was sexy.

 

A gym training programs, gift shop, renewable energy, tourist attractions, and some. Like seriously. That's where I get my experience from it's from having all of those different businesses, ask me how do we market our business and me having to work it out and find it out and testing things and, and doing one thing in one business, which works amazingly. And something else that doesn't, you know what I mean? It's it's through that experience anyway, I didn't mean to go on that little rant. Uh, if you're not in my email list, head over to the website, teresaheatwareing.com Get on the email list. It'd be great to see you over there and I better get on with today's interview. So today's interview is with the lovely Jennifer, who is CEO and founder of a high vibe.

 

Facebook ads squad. She's helped hundreds of businesses generate millions of dollars on Facebook and Instagram and seen that a thousand percent plus return on that ad campaigns. Her all female team enjoys crunching data and helping women owned businesses, making tons of money and smashing the patriarchy.

 

Jennifer has been featured in Forbes listed as one of top Facebook ads manager to watch in 2019 and has an inspiring story about how she escaped domestic violence left a successful company that she co founded and started her own all female agency. I hope you enjoy it. Here she is. So I am really excited today to welcome to the podcast, Jennifer Spivak. Jennifer.

 

Lovely to meet you. How are you doing?

 

Jennifer: I am doing amazingly lovely to meet you as well.

 

Teresa: Good, good stuff. And we were just chatting that Jennifer's in New York and I'm in rural structure. So we couldn't probably be two opposite places. If you try. And this is it. Nice weather in New York at the moment we're, we're recording this in September.

 

Jennifer: Beautiful. It is like, like breezy, but still like cool weather on the weekends. Like I'm living my best life right now in this moment.

 

Teresa: Nice, nice. Well, with, even though it's summer here in the UK, we're having. We had an early nice summer, but now it's like, no, we're done. We're done that spring back the rain.

 

I know. So sad, so sad. So Jennifer, for my audience, if you can tell them, let's just kick off with a little bit about who you are and why you got doing what you're doing today.

 

Jennifer: So, um, I own an all female Facebook and Instagram advertising agency. We work primarily with other women entrepreneurs. Um, and you know, something, I find myself saying a lot.

 

Is it. Yes, we're an ad agency, but that isn't the point, right? That's like, that's the means to the end of putting more money in the hands of more women, that's actually, what's behind everything that we do. It's why I have an all female team. It's why we mostly do work with other women entrepreneurs. And it's also why we donate a percentage of everything that we make to an organization that helps survivors of domestic violence achieve financial autonomy and independence through entrepreneurship and, um, other aspects of their programs. So. Money for more women is the goal and it's behind everything.

 

Teresa: I love it. I love it. And actually, I think you're probably one of the first people I've interviewed. I've interviewed people that have, who are very, I'm going to try and say, philanthropic. That's the right word. Isn't it? That do give money, but not in the sense of it's a structured thing.

 

So two, two questions really, first, why women, and then why that charity?

 

Jennifer: Why not women? I mean, isn't it. Like I'm okay. Let me try and not push right now

 

Teresa: to take me down.

 

Jennifer: Isn't it, our time, like, come on, you know, and I don't know, I kind of have this experience of just like the world and the planet that there's a incredibly large amount of unfulfilled women, like walking around in our world. Now money is certainly not the only path to making people more fulfilled.

 

Right. And I'm certainly not saying that. But when somebody is able to, you know, and you have, you would, you would know about this too, right? Like entrepreneurship is potentially one of the most fulfilling things in the world. I think you get to create your own life, your own story, your own schedule, your own, everything.

 

And then to be able to be successful in that, which is the money coming back to you, like gives you control and autonomy over your life. And I believe that when you feel you have control and autonomy over your life, that is what creates fulfillment. And so on a really macro level, we need this and I'm going to like do my part to create it in my own small way, through a skill that I happen to have, which is Facebook ads.

 

Teresa: Yeah. Yeah. And I think one thing that's really interesting with this is. There's not only historic, the women have played a very different role and we had very different careers and very different looking lives and that sort of thing. But also the money thing in particular is really interesting in the fact of I've always, you know, when I was with my ex husband, I've always earned a good amount of money and more than he has.

 

And that is a really, sensitive subject. So you sent over, it was like, Oh, I've just set the light on the podcast, but it is not only for us, but males in our lives. And also, almost as if like we shouldn't that we're the breadwinner is the man. And it's a ridiculous concept that we're still, that is still a range, but.

 

But it is, you know, that is still most generation and other people's generation and some people today, that's still the, what they think. So even getting that confidence around, no, this is okay, this isn't about, that's your role and you should sit in that and earn whatever it is a case of you can do and be anything that you want to be.

 

Jennifer: Absolutely. I mean, it's, you know, one small thing inside of that, that I always feel really passionate about is I am incredibly vocal with my family, my friends, and my online world with like about how much money I'm making. I actually think it's really to each their own. Right. I'm not saying anyone has to.

 

Um, but for me that feels like a really good way of saying, Hey, y'all this is okay. Like, watch me look at me and let me be like the North star of, like we can have desires.

 

Teresa: Yeah.

 

Jennifer: Right around all things, but money and growth and our own like personal journeys. And, um, yeah, I just, I really look to like, be that example as much as possible.

 

Teresa: And that's the other thing as well that people in general, but particularly women, they don't want to have that money conversation. Like I am really open and I do, um, I have programs that, that obviously I work with business owners and, and there's one program that I have, which is a 90 day program, much more in depth, much more kind of.

 

You know, you're making a shift, this is going to move you. And one of the questions I'd get them to fill in this big, long questionnaire which is a pain, but it's important. And there are probably two or three questions actually in there that are directly ask them the money question. Literally. How much do you charge?

 

What do you earn? What do you spend? And it's like, and I know for some of them. Having to write that dime makes them feel really uncomfortable. And it's like, there's no judgment. I'm not here to go. Ooh. Is that all? Wow. It's it's. I need to understand these things in order to help you move forward. And do you know what inevitably, like there's a lady that I just started working with, uh, on the last 90 day, her, what she's charging, literally makes me on a week, but like it's ridiculous, and, and it's having that confidence to go. You know how good you are and what you're offering, you should be charging more than this, and I'm not always back there straight put your prices up. It's that's not always the case. But I do think particularly as women, there is an element of,

 

Oh, well, Kind of don't want to go and take that step or be that kind of brave about it. So, yeah. I love that. I love that. So tell me about the charity. Why, why was it? Cause we had not had many people or not have the experience of many people that do this. So what wanted to, why did you want to do this?

 

Jennifer: So many reasons. So, so, um, this was maybe, I don't know three years ago and I literally thought to myself, I want to be, you know, the business was growing, you're making more money.

 

I knew that having a philanthropic angle was always going to be a part of the business. We were getting to a place where I was able to make like decent sized contributions. And so I thought to myself, I really want to be able to do work specifically with the financial aspect of domestic violence. And I'm thinking.

 

There's nothing out there like that. I guess I have to, we create a charity, like that was literally the conversation, like, all right. I guess I'm going to have to create a nonprofit. I don't have time, but I guess I have to. And like I said, let me just Google. Right? I'm sure there's nothing this specific out there that doesn't make sense.

 

I know this space really well. And you know, first Google search this organization called free from comes up and I'm like, you have to be kidding me. It's like, I created this in my mind. So they are a you know, small, all things considering nonprofits um based in Los Angeles. And there are 100% focus is the financial aspect of domestic violence which by the way, the status that something like it's president 97%.

 

Uh, domestic violence relationships. And yet most people don't even know what financial abuse is. And so with this particular organization works to do is, um, really address it from all angles. So they help survivors actually recoup costs of being in an abusive relationship. You know, medical expenses, lost wages. Um, even like, you know, needing to go to therapy.

 

So really like financial justice, which is powerful. And then they also really focus on the like what's next piece. So a lot of the domestic violence organizations that exist that do amazing lifesaving work or about, “okay, you're not at risk of dying now like bye…” and it creates this cycle of like now what, especially in.

 

You know, let's just say the woman has been in this relationship since she was young. She didn't go to college. She doesn't have a job. Like how did she not end up back in that relationship or another relationship so free from also worked to financially empower them going forward. Um, and they have a specific program that I love, which is really helping some of their survivors become entrepreneurs. And God, like nothing could be more aligned for me.

 

Um, so. Yeah. I reached out and emailed them and they were like, Oh, you want to make a donation? I was like, no, you don't understand, like, I'm part of your team now. And, you know, you're not getting it, you know, and, and Sonia, who's the woman who runs it, who is the greatest woman on the planet, you know, will sometimes say, you know, Oh, thank you for doing XYZ.

 

And I'm like, stop thanking me like where this is a together thing. So.

 

Teresa: That's amazing. And you know what this is so funny how things aligned and things come into your world as an end point. So I had a conversation with a new member the other day, who has written a book about domestic abuse because she was in a relationship where it happened in hers was, um, I think focused more on kind of the mental abuse that she received.

 

And one of the things that she wasn't allowed to do is have a job because of the fact that the control and the financial control. And actually she ended up doing, I think her words that she described as this little business on the side, just something, but what it meant for her was it started to, obviously, I guess her husband at the time didn't realize that it was making her any money.

 

And obviously he was happy cause she was at home and not really doing or not being out and not having a job. But what it was doing for her was enabling her to get some kind of financial freedom and start building. A bit of a buffer in terms of some money to then take that move to leave and to, because I guess that's one of the biggest things that if you're sat there going, I haven't got any money.

 

I haven't got house. What the hell am I going to do?

 

Jennifer: Absolutely. Absolutely.

 

Teresa: What do you do?

 

Jennifer: Yeah. And, and you know, the reason I'm so passionate about this cause is I also was in an abusive relationship in my early twenties and I didn't know it at the time. You know I was lucky in a way. And that I did have a job and I did have some access to money.

 

Um, you know, I was in college at the time. I think I had gotten like, you know, a $2,000 scholarship or something, and I was able to put that always having knowing, and. You know, at the time, right. I'm just going through the motions, like trying to like literally save my life, but you know, the more education cause you know, for me, anytime I'm in a bad situation, like I can't help it.

 

My brain is immediately like, Oh, we're safe now, what was I supposed to learn from that? I'm supposed to become an advocate. Like what's next? Like, that's just how it works. So like the second I was out, I was like I'm volunteering. I'm learning about this. I'm like getting really involved and. It became so clear that all things considering my experience of leaving was like other seamless because I had access to money.

 

And I just remember thinking. That sounds like a bunch of BS that there could be somebody else. And there is at this moment in any moment, somebody else in my exact situation, which was so horrible living in for a year for me, that can, that literally cannot that their choice, if they want to leave and not live in the nightmare that they probably live in is like going to a shelter.

 

And I just said, “Nope, this cannot stand.” So, um, yeah. That's, you know, that's why I love this work so much.

 

Teresa: That's awesome. So awesome. And like you said, I think, I think for me, what's interesting about the new members she's now, she has been, since that day, pretty much had their own business and has a really successful business now and has a new relationship and she's written books about it and she's, you know, and that was her turning point, her business. How small it seems her at the time.

 

It felt like from what she was saying to me, she may agree or disagree, but what she was saying to me, I was like, that's that bit that made you go actually, and start taking those steps, which is amazing. Absolutely

 

Jennifer: I mean, that's what we were saying. You know, that's what I was saying earlier. Right? Like, think about. All of a sudden, it was like, Oh my God, I can create my own life. Right. And I think like through entrepreneurship, it can get little glimpses of that. Like it is creating something from nothing. And if that's possible, where does it end? Right. Can I create something from nothing at all the levels in my life.

 

And if that's true, hold on. Maybe the situation isn't for me anymore.

 

Teresa: Yeah. Yeah, no, that's awesome. I love it. I love it. Okay. Brilliant stuff. So obviously you help business owners create Facebook ads and use Instagram and basically promote their businesses through social media. But one of the things that you're particularly good at, and one of the things very passionate about is having a really good ad funnel. And I'm going, I said at the minute we got the call that I think some of the stuff I say is very different to what Jennifer's going to say, but I love this because there is no right or wrong. And there's no, just because something works for me. Doesn't mean it's going to work for everybody and vice versa. But also, why not try a different way. You know, I am personally very interested to hear your three step funnel and see how you go about converting people. Because one of the claims you make is without lead magnets. And I have a big lead magnet, but your listeners are gonna be like, “Oh,” like at the end of the day, “she had her on. And she doesn't like lead magnets because Teresa loves them.”

 

And I do love them, but I am fascinated to hear this, uh, this funnel and how it works and the success you've had with it. So do you want to kick off and just explain what the funnel is first.

 

Jennifer: Yes. And let me just preface all of this with,

 

Teresa: okay.

 

Jennifer: Um, we have plenty of clients that we do use lead magnets with. This is definitely not a like, call to like never use lead magnet. Right. And

 

Teresa: Time with lead magnets,

 

Jennifer: not at all. And I also think that goes back to exactly what you said. Like I don't ever subscribe to the style of marketing. That's like, “Lead magnets are dead. You should only be doing this.” And like, no, no matter what I say, please test everything for your own business. That's how we,

 

Teresa: Absolutely.

 

Jennifer: So with that being said, the funnel that I discovered is actually something that I originally figured out little accidentally, like backend, backend into it. And it's for my own agency lead gen. So first I was using it for myself. Now we're starting to use it for other people. And I do believe very strongly that its main implications are for done for you service businesses.

 

So not necessarily coaches and the reason why is that done for you buyers behave differently. So I, for years have been trying to crack my own online marketing. My business group for years and years through word of mouth and referrals, which is awesome. But. You lose control of your own growth. And that drove me bonkers, literally like infuriated me all the time.

 

Like I want to be in charge. I want to be in control. Um, and you know, I was doing all of my marketing the way that coaches do their marketing. Cause that was really what was out there in terms of the training. Right. You have to lead maggie, you have a webinar, you do this, you do that. I kept saying, you know, do like, I think about my clients, like, would they ever watch a webinar on Facebook ads? Like they don't want to know anything about Facebook ads, right? Like they really just, they're a different type of buyer. They don't want to learn. They don't want to sit through a training. They want the right offer at the right time with the right person. And that's it. There are done for you buyer.

 

You don't need all the upfront nurture and education. And so. When I realized that, and I realized that, okay, I've been spending all this money to list build for years. And I had some successful that it wasn't like it was nothing, but it wasn't the system that I was looking for. I wanted the system that I could say, I know if I spend X, I'm going to make Y that's what we build for clients.

 

I wanted it for myself. So. On a whim. I said, “I don't know. I mean, this technically goes against all the rules, but what if I start sending ads to totally cold traffic? Just to book a call with me? Like technically this shouldn't work. I don't know. Let me try. I'll put it at $10 a day. No big deal.” I forgot about it, which is the best thing that's ever happened to me because otherwise I would have done what all Facebook ads managers do, which is start tinkering with it and testing it and to touching too many works. Really just forgot about it for a couple of weeks.

 

And I noticed that I was starting to get calls booked that weren't referrals. It didn't really know where they were coming from. And, you know, at some point I went back and I looked and I said, “Oh my God, this thing is actually working”. So basically the whole system is, it's a really good, strong, simple ad. I think more important of this is that we don't get too creative.

 

I've tested a couple of different headlines, the right time to get really creative. And then the only one that ever converts is done for you Facebook ads, seriously. Anytime I've tried to be like more cute with it, like emojis. So it's like, “Hello, this is what this is. And this is who I am.” That's it. I send that totally cold traffic.

 

To a really beautiful, robust landing page, but I guess it's almost like a page and of itself for me and my agency. So it's got all the right messaging, um, you know, really great photos and visuals, a little bit about our process, who we worked with a great video, all that good stuff. Um, and from there people immediately go to the booking page.

 

Now this is a one small piece that's important. We have an application form that does an excellent job of deterring the wrong people, because the fact of the matter is Facebook ads, you're going to get a mixed bag. Yep. Let's plan for that, right? Like when clients are like, well, “How do we, you know, do perfect targeting?”

 

I'm like, well, “There's no such thing.” Yeah. So, so I really have a lot of almost like check points, even though it's just add landing page looking page, right. It's very simple. There's still a lot of checkpoints of like, “Woah, woah, woah, if you are not, this, this may not be for you. Woah, woah, woah this is how much you charge every month.

 

And this is our minimum ad spend.” Um, so I priced qualify multiple times. Like when other people will add it, they're like, that feels like a lot. And I'm like, people didn't read it when it was once people didn't read it when it was twice. But once I finally added a third price, qualifier people mostly got it. So people, you know, looking through that form. And then there's even more fun. Right. And so I feel like most people, I think that once the call is booked, it's done. Right then they just rely on like the automatic call reminders. Nope. We'll take it for level. I have got this amazing email sequence that starts delivering once somebody books and it's just straight, like.

 

Building credibility building know, like, and trust further qualifying people. And I've had some people respond to those emails and say, “You know what I realize, I'm not ready. I'm going to cancel the call” and what a miracle that is.

 

Teresa: Perfect.

 

Jennifer: It's amazing, right. And so the fact that like anecdotal evidence that this is doing the right thing.

 

And in addition to these ongoing emails that run, I kind of create a similar experience with retargeting ads that are also just straight. Education content, building credibility, building know like and trust and above all else. And this is one thing that I've noticed. I do a little bit differently from other people.

 

Um, I like people really get a sense of who I am really, really. This is beyond in quotations personal brand, because I believe that that can often actually be rather manufactured, right? Like even just like, let's figure out my personal brand. I just exist as myself. I actually don't know any other way.

 

Like, it's either a shower of blessing. I'm not really sure.

 

Teresa: You decide? Yeah. Some people would love it. Some people not so much. And that's fine.

 

Jennifer: We don't know. But so it really is. What I noticed is that the experience that gets created is competition becomes irrelevant. It is no longer I'm shopping around for different ad agencies.

 

It's I love Jennifer. I'm working with Jennifer. I don't even care what she's selling. I am buying it. And I have people show up to calls. Number one, they're almost everybody comments on the email sequence and they just go, “Wow, like that's so impressive. Nobody does that.” And people really love that. And at the end of the day, people are showing up to my sales call saying things like, I didn't know, you existed three days ago.

 

And you know, today I would like to both hire you and also be your best friend. How can you.

 

And so that's a great way to start a sales call, right? It's not a sales call anymore. So, um, you know, that's kind of the whole system. It really is. Simple. Like I said, um, it feels good. Feels aligned. There's no false urgency.

 

There's no pushiness. There's no sales tactics. It's just like, “Hey, this is who we are. This is who I am. And this is what we do. Do you want us to do it for you?” And it has been wildly successful.

 

Teresa: That's amazing. So let me, I've been writing notes as you've been talking, so there's a couple of things I wanted to check.

 

So your ad simple, the things of landing page, the application form, how in depth is the applicant form?

 

Jennifer: Pretty in depth?

Um, off the top of my head, I don't know the exact number, but there's probably 10 to 15 questions on there.

 

Teresa: Yeah.

 

Jennifer: Um, and so it's, you know, it's the standard stuff. Right. And how do you use Facebook ads before?

 

Tell me about your business. What are your price points? Um, you know, so just the regular stuff I need left. But then I have multiple different questions that came to get at, how serious somebody is. So the standard thing that everybody has been trained to do is you know, what's your revenue. And I have found that people are just notoriously horrible.

 

I feel like that accurately in a way where it actually gives me the right information, because for example, this is something I see. Sometimes their business might be brand new, but they've got three other businesses that are, you know, seven figure businesses. So they can clearly find it working with me. But their putting down that they're under a hundred cut.

 

So it's like I've known that question in and of itself is one way to get at is somebody writes, it, it doesn't work by itself. So I also asks things like, when are you looking to begin advertising? I find that that really has a person stop and think, Oh, okay. This is real, like I'm excited. Yeah. Potentially. Um, I ask, um, I actually specifically state.

 

“This is our pricing and this is our minimum ad spend, please type got it, to confirm you understand?” Cause when it was a check, it wasn't the same thing. Right. I actually make people like affirm through typing.

 

Teresa: I get this.

 

Jennifer: And what's so cool is that sometimes I've seen people write, like, got it. Oh, my God, that was scary to write. Wow. And I'm like, people are having transformational experiences, freaking filling out the applications. Like it's up leveling them just by filling it out. Like they're saying, wow, that was scary, but you're repping and I” can do this.”

 

How cool. And um, my favorite is there's a box, you have to check at the very bottom that says “We don't work with douchebags. Please check here to confirm you're not a douchebag.”

 

Teresa: That is brilliant. So can I just sorta like say a couple of things, cause I know if, if you are, if you're listening to this and you're like, gosh, that side's a lot, right? This is done on purpose. Obviously Jennifer is, is trying to attract a certain type of customers that an audience. And if you can't be bothered to go through that application process, then they're not the right customer for you.

 

So. I don't want people to listen to thinking, well, that might put people off well good. Because then you know, the right people and making it so explicit about the finance. Cause the other thing, actually, I didn't mention that we do have a lot of sort of freelancers. We have lots of social media managers that offer that service.

 

Jennifer: This is perfect for them by the way.

 

Teresa: Perfect. And I know a lot of them I've had conversations with the past and I remember feeling out as when I started was like, “You would give your price to someone and they'd go, Oh no, and too expensive.” And you'd go, “Oh okay yeah.” And then you just instantly lower it because of the, I need this work. Whereas there is something about that confidence of going, this is what we charge.

 

Please confirm that. You can afford it or that this is where you want to pay. The other thing is, and I think I've talked about this on the podcast where, and I'm sure you would have done this experience as well when you first started was so someone will say to you, ah, I'm thinking about using your services.

 

Can we have a coffee? Right? And then I went and meet them for coffee. They have a real example of a lady who I met for coffee. Three hours later. Teresa has spilled her entire brain onto the table, written her a strategy. Virtually told her all the things, because I am excited about this stuff. I love this stuff and I can see so many opportunities for her.

 

And then not only am I driven to, to meet her. So that's probably like, 30 minutes. I might have three hours, three hours. My time management is appalling and then I've driven back for 30 minutes. That's four hours. Then I get back to the office and I write up a proposal, which probably takes me another two hours.

 

And then I email her and she doesn't get back to me. And I email her again and she doesn't get back to me and she so I've probably spent like another 10, 15 minutes on that for her to come back and go. “I'm really sorry. Can't afford you.”

 

Jennifer: Yeah.

 

Teresa: Like what a waste of time.

 

Jennifer: Exactly. And why are we so freaking afraid of having boundaries around how we prospect and do lead gen and sales calls?

 

Like I have no problem reaching out to somebody that is booked with me and said, Hey, I think based on your questions where like you're not ready yet. Um, so I'm going to cancel the call. Let me know if you want a referral to somebody else. My calls are 30 minutes. I don't play. They are 30 minutes. I am not driving anywhere to anybody.

 

I am not putting on pants for a sales call. That is simply unacceptable. We are not doing that over here. Um, and I also don't do a lot of like jumping through hoops. Um, on the rare occasion that somebody is like, “Oh, can I see, you know, examples of this? And can you mark up this? And can you set.” No, no, I really cannot because that's not how I do sales.

 

Um, I connect with people that know instantly that I'm their person and that's that. And so why would I do all of that extra work? Those people are the difficult people that maybe don't even want as clients, but they're also probably not going to hire us anyway.

 

Teresa: No, and you're right. Cause that's the other thing.

 

Cause I've been in a position where I've been in a meeting with someone and thought, Oh my gut saying, don't work with you. And unfortunately we make our fearful money mindset, get a bit scared and go, “But I need the money or I want the money.” And then you go, “Okay.” And you'd probably take it for a bit less than you would have done.

 

And you work with this person and it turns out to be an absolute disaster because the person who couldn't afford you, who is taking up nine more of your time than they should do, their expectations are higher than they should be. And the whole thing is just an absolute pain in the neck. So, so I really want to get that across and I know, I know what's going to happen and I want you to answer this.

 

They're going to be sat there, going. But it's all right for you. They're going to be sat there thinking, well, it's okay for you. You've got a big agency now. You've got lots of clients. But it wasn't like that always was it,

 

Jennifer: It definitely wasn't. But I will say I, I came in with some pretty clear boundaries.

 

Like I've gotten to like, they're, they're way more clearly defined right now. But and look, I've definitely done exactly what you just described right. Last year. Right? It's not even like, Oh, it was like five years ago. Like, no, right. I'm still making ill-decisions all the time. Come on. I don't think that ever ends.

 

Um, but uh, I believe that there's opportunity for women, especially cause look, let's take business off the table. Women. Aren't usually great with boundaries. That's a thing that we tend to bump up against as well. So I think there's an opportunity, no matter where you are in your business and by the way, your boundaries and mine don't have to be the same.

 

Right. It's just what works for me. Somebody else may feel into it and say, okay, so this other thing, it feels good to me, but I think there's always room to make sure you're in charge of this process. It's your business. You are the business owner. You are the CEO, whether you've stepped into that yet or not.

 

I know a lot of times in the beginning, I'm still going through my own transition with that too. Right. Of like transitioning, you know, freelancer or implementer to CEO. But you are the CEO of your business if you're listening to this. Um, and so what are your non-negotiable? And you can start out. You know, with something that is not as maybe tightened or clearly defined mine is, but set it and keep it.

 

And as you go, you can adjust.

 

Teresa: And you're right. I think we. In the early days, we don't think about those non-negotiables we don't think about what ones, because we just sat there thinking I want the business. But the problem is it's sets you up for the biggest failure in the long run. It sets you up for clients messaging you and I am saying this because I've done it.

 

On a Friday night saying, can we just jump on a call at seven o'clock? No, we cannot. It's Friday night. And if I have not three gins by then, there's something wrong, you know? So I don't want that expectation. I don't want people to think that. Yeah. I want them to know from day one. And like you said, whereas people are, you know, from a sales point of view, the focus is always on getting the sale.

 

Well, actually the focus should be on. Getting the right sale and putting off the people that you don't want. And like you said, some people will go through your process and go, “Great. I love her. I want her” great others will go through and go. She's not for me the same with me. You know, I am really honest.

 

Like you said, this is, it comes to way more than just being personal brand. It's about going, no, this is actually me. And if you like me, great and if you don't, that's cool. But yeah. The other thing I was going to say is, um, Oh yeah, that was, it. Just jumped out ahead of this back here. So the other thing that I love about what you do, and I want people to think about this really carefully, especially those freelancers and social media managers like that.

 

You giving them a point in which they have to have for a budget for a Facebook ad is great. Because, you know, as do all the other people listening that if they're not willing to invest either financially, or let's say for instance, they're taken on a social media client and they have to say, you have to provide me with X, Y, Z.

 

If they're not doing that. And if they're not giving you the budget, you can't produce a good outcome. And if you can't produce a good outcome, You're going to have a crap feeling about that. They're going to have a bad feeling about that. And then you're going to have no testimonial and no evidence that you're good at what you do.

 

And actually that was nothing to do with you. It was to do with you did the best you could with a bad setup.

 

Jennifer: Yeah. I mean, look that all just connects, you know, it's the clear boundaries, the clear vision, like really knowing what you are creating versus, Oh God, I need the sale. I got to make it work for this person.

 

Like. And look the fact of the matter is I don't, I think it's a Rite of passage. I don't think, I don't think anyone's going to be listening to this and it we're going to actually save them from themselves. They're going to do it anyway, cause we all do. right?

 

Teresa: It takes time. So

 

Jennifer: it's a Rite of passage. So there's also like freedom and like, okay.

 

You know, if you're listening, don't worry.

 

Teresa: We have to learn.

 

Jennifer: And the first time that it happens, that it hurts. That's when you go, “Oh, okay. I really get it now. And so that's all good. And that's fine.” Um, yeah, but, uh, but yeah, like it, it doesn't, you know, look, it's only money, right? Like, like really, really, you know, and I know easier said than done.

 

Right.

 

Teresa: But you are right.

 

Jennifer: There was a certain extent it's true. And so, um, you know, longterm and then for your own like soul and sanity, it is 99% of the time better to really just focus on and, you know, clear out. Space for the people that aren't right. So that the right people can come in.

 

Teresa: Exactly. Because if you're working with someone that's taken up your time and not much money, you're stopping yourself from getting that good client. Okay. Couple more things I want to ask you. So you said that in your email sequence, you concentrate on them. Because obviously you're going to a cold audience. This cold audience don't know they are. If they go to the process and actually put in, then you're using those email sequence to warm you up at that point, which is interesting because literally this is on its head because normally we'd go right, warm them up, then send them a lead magnet, then do this.

 

But you know, this is great. And I love this. So the emails that you're sending them, what type of things are you putting in the email so that they get to know you and you get their attention?

 

Jennifer: So one thing I'll just say before I get into some of the detail is that there's some people I've been implementing this system with and they're like the emails have to be all about the cost, the client.

 

That's what we're taught. I'm like, “No, stop, stop. We're not doing that here.” Right. It really is about Me. And I think that the willingness to do that is what creates that connection. Like people know my personality before they get on the phone with me. So basically what I kind of drilled down. Um, in kind of seeing like, it's, it's interesting.

 

I didn't create the system and then execute it. “I found myself inside of it and said, wow, okay. I guess there's a system here. Now let me try it. Yeah. And like, make it a little bit more formulaic.” But I found that the messaging that I use really drills down to four key buckets. Number one is your credibility.

 

That's where we're all comfortable doing marketing. We know that stuff. That's what probably 99% of your current messaging is, it's important but by itself, it's not enough because you want to know what there's a million other people that do exactly what you do that we'll have the same testimonials. The same media features the same screenshots.

 

It's not enough. So that's one piece. The second piece is personality. Now, some people start to have a little bit of this, but again, it's a little bit, um, manufactured, right? So I think there's always room to like go a step further in terms of not, what do you want to put out there in terms of your business? Who are you? Like let people actually have the opportunity to create that connection with. That one's like the fun, the quirky, you know, it's like, I've literally spent money on an ad that is like a picture of my cat on my laptop. Like there's no call, no call to action. It's my cat because I, you know, people know that I'm like a cat person.

 

Like they know that about me and they come on the call and that's something they can connect to. Right. So that's one piece. The third piece is vulnerability. Everybody gets scared here, because again, they want to do the manufactured vulnerability. So there are like multiple stories and touch points throughout my funnel about, you know, my experience with domestic violence.

 

They talk about that incredibly openly. And, um,

 

Teresa: And that's gonna being realistic here that is going to put some people not off, but it's it, that will be uncomfortable for some people to read, but also uncomfortable for some people to be that honest about something in their life.

 

Jennifer: Yes. And it's so funny because you know, I am in the process now of delivering a beta round of a programming building called million dollar agency.

 

That's going to teach this system to other agency owners and done for you service providers. And it was a lot of almost pushback around the vulnerability piece. Like they were like, this feels like telling a sad story to like make a buck and I'm like, “No, you're, you've missed them.” And I get that right. I totally understand it.

 

Um, but you know, the way I framed it is that this isn't about your business or marketing, actually at all. This is about the stories that you must tell, because if again, Must and Oh, by the way, it's also going to how create some connection in your business that would probably lead to money. But that isn't the freaking point.

 

I talk about my story because I have to. I have to, it is why I am on this planet is a work I'm supposed to do. The fact that it also helps my business is really, really cool, but it's not the point.

 

Teresa: Okay. So that's vulnerability. And then so what's the last one?

 

Jennifer: And then the last one is like a feel good or something around like being in contribution.

 

So obviously for us, we have our connection with the charity. Um, I've had other clients who are like, well, it's more about like our commitment to diversity and hiring, you know, LGBTQ people and people of color. Awesome. Right. So it's the thing that makes something that is not necessarily directly tied to what you do, but has somebody go, Okay.

 

On top of the fact that I trust this person, I connect with them and I think they're smart. I can also feel good about spending my money here because part of it goes to these other causes and things that are important to me.

 

Teresa: Yeah. Yeah. I love that. And again, right. And this is why I love it doing the podcast.

 

This is why I love speaking to different people who do different things because. Because you present different things to me because you literally everything I talk about you're flipping, but I can see why and how that would work. And I can especially see it like at the moment. And I think you'd agree.

 

Cause you've already said it's good for a done for you service. So when, and if it's a knowledge industry, It's going to look different and it might not work and you might need to rethink or whatever, because obviously for, for me, I don't do calls of people. I don't get on the phone with them. And therefore it's a very different process.

 

What is interesting is. I would, and I'm really honest here, because I'm not saying I'm right or have all the answers, but I would advise, or I do say in the past it is about them. They don't care about you, but like, actually, what is interesting is, is that you are, by that point, they've already decided they want the service because they've booked in for the call and they've already qualified.

 

They can afford it. So by tipping that on its head and by having that already done, there is. You don't need to talk about them anymore because they're ready to take that step. So you can talk about you and the service and how you are and how you work and what your passion is and that sort of thing, and why they should care about working with you.

 

Because like you said, normally we focus it all on them because we're trying to get the buy-in, you know? So when I talk about creating a sales page, I'll talk about, you know. Make sure they understand that, you know, how they feel and what their life is like, and that they can relate to the words you say, and they can dah, dah, dah, dah.

 

But actually by that point, by the fact that they've booked a call means I bought into all that. I know, you know me, I know, you know my business. I know, you know what I'm trying to achieve. I know you can do the thing. So therefore these emails don't need to be great. You know, let me tell you why this is important for your business, but I know it's important for my business because I bought the bloody call. Like, so I think, I think that's awesome.

 

I really, really liked that. I really like the kind of credibility in the, in the feel good personality. One thing I wanna ask, does anybody else take the calls other than you.

 

Jennifer: No.

 

Teresa: No, and I think I want to say that. And I guess that was the answer, but I wants to make it really abundantly obvious because if people are out there, thinking well I didn't like to be boss.

 

I don't want to do it well, hard luck I'm afraid in the nicest sense of the word you are doing this because it's you on the end of that phone.

 

Jennifer: Yes, absolutely. I think that's a key piece to making it work. If it wasn't me? We would rework some of it. Yeah, but I have chosen, even as I've grown an agency, I mean, there's 10 of us.

 

I have chosen to remain a tremendous part of the front facing brands, the whole onboarding process, the touch point with my clients that is really important to me. It has, each has my name like it's, you know. But you know, two things, I love sales calls. Love sales calls could do them all day long. Like I'm having the most fun, um, you know, nobody can, can obviously see me right now, who's listening, but I like, you know, where are these like silk robes?

 

Teresa: Like, what are we wearing here today?

 

Jennifer: I've been talk with people like still fun. But another thing that I think is relevant is. Quote, unquote sales calls. And what I do are not necessarily the same thing, because you have to keep in, find everything that's happened up until when they get on. Like for everyone who's listening.

 

Just imagine if your sales call started with someone saying, “Hi, I'm literally obsessed with you. I want to be your best friend.” Like wouldn't that not feel like a sales call? Wouldn't that just feel like fun and relaxed. And they know the investment. They know who you've worked with, they know your testimonials, they know about like, we're literally just connecting.

 

So I find that a lot of what people don't like about sales calls actually goes out the window a little bit with this sort of approach.

 

Teresa: Yeah. Yeah. And also I'm just thinking about these emails and the personality and that sort of thing. And I want to mention that. Whenever I share something. So every Wednesday I emailed my list and I emailed them a few weeks ago from when, while we record this.

 

But obviously it'll be a bit more by the time he listened to this, unfortunately, mum had passed away and I had not been around for a couple of weeks. And you know that actually, when you're an entrepreneur and you run your own business and you're, and something dreadful happens, that's really hard going because you've got to kind of make that decision and how you manage it.

 

And the amount of replies, the amount of stuff I got back from that, I can't even tell you. I think I spent no joke about two or three days solidly replying to everybody. Because I promise that if someone emails me, I'll reply to them and I'm probably replies because people wrote the most amazing, beautiful things that I wasn't just going to go, “Oh, thank you so much, Teresa.”

 

You know, I wanted to be like, “Oh, you know, I really appreciate what you said there, or that was so kind verse” whatever it was. Because I, I took that vulnerability to the, to the nth degree in the sense of sharing. And even though, even now, it's like, Oh, I need to stop talking now it's because I keep going on about that.

 

My mum died. Everybody knows that already. But, but obviously that was such a huge thing in my world at that point. And that is a lesson to learn. Cause I'm not here. You have you got, do you Enneagram, if you have done the Enneagram test?

 

Jennifer: I'm an A.

 

Teresa: You're an A, okay. I'm a three. I wondered whether you were that's on the

 

Jennifer: I think like I'm a second one.

 

Yeah,

Teresa: yeah, yeah. So you'd like to see. I think I'm always one about taking lessons from, so again, for me, it was like, actually, there's a lesson here about how do you manage it? How do you then. So one of the lessons that I kind of talked about at the time was how lucky I am that I'd got my team. Because, and also someone messaged me there's and again, this is perfect.

 

A friend of mine is like, how you doing that? And I was like, yeah, you know, getting slowly back to a level of normality and I've just had to cancel. I think I, I, I think I canceled your call actually. Um, I didn't. Oh, did I, I don't know. Anyway, I had to cancel it and stuff and anyway, and, um, and she actually replied saying, I bet you're so grateful for your team and scheduling.

 

And I was like, yes, I am. Because she's like, you've been turning up every day, even though you've not been turning up every day. You know? So it's things like that, that I could take the lesson and go, actually, if you're not doing this, how would you cope if literally your world stopped? And you had to go and deal with that thing.

 

How would your business carry on, how would you continue making money? You know, for me having online business and what was lovely is it carried on? So without me even being present for those few weeks, that I wasn't. So, so yeah, I think the vulnerability aspect of it, I think might put some people off, but actually if they're, if they put them off, if they're not for you, they're not your

 

Jennifer: A hundred percent. I mean, it's like without realizing it. A lot of what we are taught. And again, it's, it's not about, you know, my approach versus yours. Like there's definitely aspects of like my landing page copy and my ad copy that speaks to the main point. Helps them see themselves in it. Yeah. Use the picture of what's possible in the testimonial.

 

So yes, to that and a lot of what we're taught without realizing it, it invertedly blocks connection. Like it literally says don't get too close. You know, here's my front facing pretty personal brand that I've manufactured, but don't get too close.

 

That's scary. And. I live my life as an open book. I don't, I don't really know any other way.

 

Um, and you know, I've had multiple, multiple scenarios even just so I know for a fact that the third email in my sequence is the one where I really get into the domestic violence story. The subject line is fighting the patriarchy one Facebook ad at a time, just my freaking favorite subject. And people regularly responds to that email.

 

And again, this is like they're, they're in the process of they're in the space between having booked and getting on the phone with me. Anyone that's run Facebook ads knows you're normally dealing with. You know, people, you know, booking and forgetting about a canceling calls, not showing up and I'm instead having people respond and going.

 

This was so amazing. Thank you so much for sharing this.

 

Teresa: And I'm looking forward. Just speaking to you, you know, they're not going to cancel on you. Are they?

 

Jennifer: Right? And I get a lot of, Oh, you know, me too, or my sister or my friend or my brothers, you know, it's Oh. And so it really, really, really is creating connection.

 

And look, the fact of the matter is whatever your story is. We are all humans. And so most of our stories are in some level relatable, right? They're like what your version of it. Is there something about it that another human being it's going to be able to connect to and relate to? And that level of connection, like all the rules around what business is supposed to look like in competition goes out the window and becomes relevant.

 

Teresa: Absolutely. There were some people that regardless of what they're offering on their customer for life, cause I love them and I resonate with a story or I get them or I want to hear from them or I love how to deliver it or, but it's them, it's not necessarily the product. It's not necessarily the, the execution of it or the experience or the degree they've got it's about the fact that they spoke in a way that I can get and that I can resonate with. And that is open enough for me to go. Ah, yeah. You know, I've had that experience where I love the fact that you're open about it. Okay. So I'm really conscious of your time.

 

And this has just been such, I'll just look to the time. And I was like, “geez what is the time” and “Did we start like late later than we did? No, no. We've been talking for quite a while. This is just difficult me by the way. So the one last thing I want to ask is, did you say that you remarket to people once they've booked?

 

Jennifer: Yes.

 

Teresa: So I want to just like, put this out there before you answer this in one way in my head, I'm like, well, why, why would you do that?

 

Because they've booked, you've got them to do the goal that you want them to do. And I know every reason you're going to give me I'm going to go genius, but I won't be able to think I am thinking that too, if you're thinking that listening to this, because ordinarily you wouldn't necessarily spend money to, to someone that you've got to do, the thing you want them to do. So what's your thinking behind that?

 

Jennifer: Remember, we're just, we just were talking about, you know, getting somebody to book is not the end all be all. Everybody else forgets about the space between when they book and when they get on the call and then even the space after where they're making their decision.

 

Cause I never push a hard sell over the phone. It's just not my style. Like if people, you know, 48 hours to 72 hours. Um, and so it's, it's hardly older when they hardly. Um, and you know, for me, it's, it's actually not just the people who book with me. Um, it's if you have any touch point with me on the internet, I will then follow you around the internet until you dies.

 

Teresa: I love it.

 

Jennifer: That's nice. I mean, I literally

 

Teresa: I will be on your, on your headstone. She follows you around the internet.

 

Jennifer: And if you want us to get better, go to my website and watch, like, I will be different. Every time you open up your internet browser, Facebook, Instagram, articles, I will be there. There'll be my face. Oh, it'll be like me and this robe also like splitting up, you know, giving a lesson about, you know, something or a picture of my cat.

 

Um, and again, it just continues to, by the way, don't spend a lot of money on that because to create everywhereness for a small audience is actually not that expensive.

 

Teresa: Yes. Sorry. That was the other thing I was going to ask actually is, Facebook likes big audiences. So, cause I know again, people are sat might be sat here thinking, well, you know, I might not have many calls and will that remarketing ads work, but let's be completely honest here.

 

Even if you're taking calls all day, every day, that is still not a massive audience.

 

Jennifer: And you should, and again, I like to retarget. Anybody that has had a touch point with me. So that includes the people who booked as well as all website visitors, anyone that engaged with me on Instagram, anyone that engaged with me on Facebook, anyone that watches my videos, anyone on my email list.

 

Like once you're in my world, you can't, you can't forget me. And so I don't, I, you know, look there a certain you're right. There would be a certain stuff, size of business where if they had enough volume, it might make sense to just do it specifically for the people who have booked, but. I don't make things more complicated than they need to be.

 

Like, here's the truth. There are aspects of this system that could be that I do in a way where it's just like, okay, this is good enough. It's not like, perfect. It's not like, Oh, let me make sure the ad stop when they sign on with me. Yeah. It's like not worth all the extra effort. The fact of the matter is I create everywhereness people see me everywhere from the first touch point they've had with me.

 

I mean, I've even add like on a dating app. A guy like asked for my Instagram and then come back two days later and be like, your ads are literally stocking me all over the internet. And I'm thinking this is side service. I should offer, like, make your dates obsessed with you. Like, is this,

 

Teresa: That is hilarious. I love that. I love that, that is so funny, so funny.

 

Jennifer: But yeah, I was when I was just, just to make it really clear. At any given time, it's usually about 10 different pieces of content or ads or posts. And I will spend anywhere from one to $2 a day on each one. So we're talking about sometimes literally 10 dollars a day to create true everywhereness where nobody's consciously thinking.

 

Oh, she's everywhere. Like just for me, they're like, how should they work? She must really know what she's doing. She might

 

Teresa: That's the other thing, because obviously you are promoting and selling ads. And so you want them to be like, I've seen your ad everywhere. Cause it's like, well, what if that was you and your customers?

 

Jennifer: Yeah, it's wild sometimes. And I'm like having a sales call with somebody who came in on that funnel and we're going to build the same funnel for them. And I'm telling about, and it's like total inception of like, “I don't know what's the matter anymore.”

 

Teresa: Yeah, no, honestly, I do that all the time. I'll go and speak on a stage when I couldn't go. And you need to offer a lead magnet or dah, dah, dah. And at the end of this, I'm going to offer you a lead magnet and you're going to watch the process in real life.

 

Jennifer: Yes.

 

Teresa: I am doing exactly what I'm going to tell you to do, which is why I'm telling you. Cause it works for me. So yeah, it is funny. It's a bit like a surreal world. And you're doing it.

 

Jennifer: Yeah.

 

Teresa: Right? Honestly. So just really quickly, just one more question. This is like a niche that I don't think I've made so many notes ever. So your remarketing ads, are they all value? Are they just fun? Are they, I mean, we're going to see them because I'm going stalk you a little bit and then wait for the others to come in, which this is what I do on my downtime.

 

Cause I am not sad. I really do need to get a hobby, but luckily my hobby drinking gin, I can do while stalking and looking at people's ads, screenshot thing. Like if you can see my phone. Well, to be honest, I am winning. I am winning. I ive the dream people wish they could be me.

 

And my phone is full of screenshot ads or screenshot funnels or screenshot. Honestly, we need to get able, that's all we need to do. Um, so yeah. So what kind of things are you putting up as your ads to like. Get to know you better?

 

Jennifer: It's the four messaging buckets always go back to the four messaging buckets. So look, there are definitely, you'll definitely see some of the stuff that you would expect.

 

Right? A video of me talking about how we troubleshooted a client's webinar ads, right? So like the normal stuff. Cause again, I don't want people to lose the fact that I know what I'm doing. Like let's I don't want to get too far into. “I'm fine. And I curse and I have cats” and then they're like, okay. So I know, I know what the hell I'm doing.

 

Um, so, so that there you'll see some of that there, but then you'll also see, you know, one of my, like top performing posts ever is. Um, last year for, uh, October, which is domestic violence awareness month, we wrote a pretty large check. Um, and I took a photo of that check and posted, you know, a long story of like just, Oh Mike, like, I can't believe I get to do this.

 

That like nine years of my life was one thing. And now I get to. And that one is really, really popular. Like I said, there are also literally just like my, my cat who's laying on my desk next to me right now will sometimes lay across my laptop with like Facebook ads on the back. And I'm like, Oh, this is a perfect picture.

 

You know? And so it's like cute stuff like that. Yeah, it's, it's a little bit of everything. And always, always, always like, even in my videos, um, you know, there's a video that actually starts out with me, like looking confused and I'm like, I was just looking for my phone, but I'm recording on it, where it is.

 

So it's like, it's totally off the cuff. I never dressed by the way. Like I live in pajamas, that's my life. Don't do my hair or makeup like this, this, hello. This is me. And whether I'm talking about, you know, our charity work or Facebook ads or something fun with my cats like that is there through and through.

 

Teresa: I love it. Honestly. I. Do you what, cause you are very honest. I'm very honest too, have so very center. And I looked at when, when I first looked at you as a guest and they sent me kind of ideas of what you could talk about. And I was like, she doesn't like lead magnets. I don't think I want this. But the funny thing is like, Like I said that I love when people challenge me.

 

I love when I don't know something and I've been in marketing like 16, 15 years. I've got degree in it. It's I I've done this awhile. And I learn concert was on a webinar last night, just watching something. And just if I could pick up something new or, you know, so I certainly do not think I know it all. By any stretch of imagination, but I just love the fact of hearing what people do and how it works for them.

 

And, and, and just, even if you take a few things from this, there is so much I can take from this, the fact of the sheer being everywhere. I need to get better at that. I need to get better, like just popping up around the place, but also not feeling like I've got to add some value every single time, you know, and not feeling like I've got to do.

 

You know, some crazy video about how to launch something that I can just focus more on the meat and who I am and what I do and that sort of thing. So, and I, and I know that there's going to be so many people listening to this episode. I've got lots of people that are social media freelancers such me and mine just that this actually for them is going to work absolutely.

 

Jennifer: So perfect.

 

And let me just also just tie up. You know, cause we do all this. When I talk about results, I realize they just didn't actually mention this. Um, so in the last right, cause I get too excited talking about that.

 

Teresa: I didn't care almost,

 

Jennifer: And at the end of the day, right. Like again, there's merit to the fact that it feels good and I, you know, the numbers at the end of the day.

 

Over the last five months, I've spent about $9,000 on these ads that we've closed about $230,000 in business cash in hand as a direct result, that doesn't factor in renewals. So there's, we're going to get well into, you know, three, 400, depending on how long people stay on with us. I mean, potentially even more, um, it's it's I mean, come on, that's easy money.

 

That's putting a dollar into Facebook ads, and making like 23 to 24 back every single time. And it's not like it happened once. I really, really waited until I had like, you know, a solid three to four months of data to be able to say this wasn't a fluke. This actually does work. It works.

 

Teresa: Amazing. Absolutely fabulous. I have really enjoyed that. Thank you so much, Jennifer, for coming on, I will obviously link up to everything in the show notes. I'll put everything in there and all the links I advise you that if I thought there was a way that I could apply. And what's your email funnel without actually having exhibit the core, which obviously is going to be reading because you're like, I know who you are.

 

And I don't think you'd like us to work cause I wouldn't be an agency's customer because obviously we do our own ads.

 

Jennifer: I'd like really wanted to book and cancel.

 

Uh, do they cancel this sequence will still deliver, so you could still be inside the whole process feel free,

 

Teresa: Honestly, honestly, but I advise everybody go and to take a look at this.

 

Cause I think this is just brilliant. Thank you so much. It's been an absolute pleasure to meet you and I've loved this episode. Thank you much.

 

Jennifer: Yeah me too. Thank you so much.

 

Teresa: What did you think? I really enjoyed that. I thought she was such great fun and I loved the strategy. I think if I was still managing the agency side or still trying to grow that side, I would definitely definitely consider what she said.

 

I thought she made some great points in terms of getting people converted. I thought that was awesome. Anyway, I'm going to leave you to it for this week. Thank you so much for listening as always, if you get chance and you have not yet done. So I would love a lovely five star review. On Apple podcasts, it would be so very kind of you.

 

And if you want to screenshot and tag me in Insta story, I will happily and be delighted to share that with my audience. Okay. Guys, have a fabulous week and I will see you next week.